Help some smaller Wikipedias' communities by writing the TemplateData and enabling citoid for them
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Description

Most Wikipedias have very few technically-inclined editors, and are therefore unable to write citation templates or enable them for the visual editor. Enabling citoid for them might be a mitzvah for those communities.

The simplest route would probably be importing templates from the English Wikipedia (or perhaps from the nearest fallback language). This would result in the templates being in the 'wrong' language, but this is unlikely to affect most users of the visual editor (who will use the citoid service instead of the template editor), and it might encourage more citations, less linkrot, and better reliability.

Steps:

  1. Find the citation templates used by the VE Citation tool
    1. If the VE Citation tool is not installed, first inquire at the Village Pump. Some communities do not want to use templates.
    2. Import basic 5 templates from en wiki (import requires sysop privileges).
    3. Enable Visual Editor Citation tool
  2. Write TemplateData for each template in the citation tool.
  3. Write the JSON maps in the TemplateData that citoid needs to find and use the citation templates listed in step 5.
  4. Enable the VE citation tool (non-citoid citation feature) (requires sysop privileges).
  5. Install the JSON Mediawiki message that turns on citoid (requires sysop privileges).

ToDo:

  • ja
  • hr?
  • simple

Related Objects

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Restricted Application added a project: VisualEditor. · View Herald TranscriptFeb 18 2016, 6:45 PM
Restricted Application added subscribers: StudiesWorld, Aklapper. · View Herald Transcript
Jdforrester-WMF renamed this task from Consider enabling citoid at smaller Wikipedias to Consider helping some smaller Wikipedias' communities (which?) by writing the TemplateData to enable citoid for them.Feb 18 2016, 6:54 PM
Jdforrester-WMF set the point value for this task to 8.
Whatamidoing-WMF renamed this task from Consider helping some smaller Wikipedias' communities (which?) by writing the TemplateData to enable citoid for them to Consider enabling citoid at smaller Wikipedias.Feb 18 2016, 6:54 PM
Whatamidoing-WMF updated the task description. (Show Details)
Whatamidoing-WMF removed the point value for this task.
Jdforrester-WMF renamed this task from Consider enabling citoid at smaller Wikipedias to Consider helping some smaller Wikipedias' communities (which?) by writing the TemplateData to enable citoid for them.Feb 18 2016, 6:58 PM
Jdforrester-WMF set the point value for this task to 8.
Rical added a subscriber: Rical.Feb 19 2016, 6:47 PM
Jdforrester-WMF triaged this task as Low priority.
Qgil added a subscriber: Qgil.Apr 26 2016, 7:05 AM

What about organizing, pre-scheduling, and announcing a workshop for Wikimania-Hackathon-2016? We were discussing that we need activities for newcomers, especially those tech-curious editors without deep programming skills. This looks like a good candidate.

About translations and help for translators, you could see the section Translations management.
At the end of the section the dropbox show in live which kind of help a module can display.

This tools is a parts of central modules in development.

What about organizing, pre-scheduling, and announcing a workshop for Wikimania-Hackathon-2016? We were discussing that we need activities for newcomers, especially those tech-curious editors without deep programming skills. This looks like a good candidate.

Yes, good point. Let's do that.

About translations and help for translators, you could see the section Translations management.
At the end of the section the dropbox show in live which kind of help a module can display.

This tools is a parts of central modules in development.

Rical, we need to talk :)

Trizek-WMF raised the priority of this task from Low to Normal.Apr 27 2016, 9:18 AM
Rical added a comment.May 7 2016, 1:18 PM

I start a proposition of Module:TranslatorHelper, based on existing code, to adapt.

I just updated my proposition of Module:TranslatorHelper, and informed @Trizek-WMF by direct email.

Trizek-WMF lowered the priority of this task from Normal to Low.

Lowering priority due to T137713 which is the current priority.

Trizek-WMF removed Trizek-WMF as the assignee of this task.Jul 5 2016, 8:00 AM
Trizek-WMF raised the priority of this task from Low to Needs Triage.

T137713: Discover TemplateData at Wikimania 2016's Hackathon was a Wikimania 2016's hackathon session.
I let that task to anyone who wants to grab it for the next event.

Jdforrester-WMF triaged this task as Normal priority.Jul 12 2016, 9:25 PM
Mvolz added a subscriber: Mvolz.Jul 13 2016, 1:24 PM

@Trizek-WMF I think that central repository for templates is a great idea and probably would help with this a lot. But presumably the /doc page would be local?

From just going through all the wikis that already have citoid enabled for this task https://phabricator.wikimedia.org/T114515, it is clear that even for these wikis either a) The documentation and/or translation for enabling citoid really bad or b) They simply don't have enough people interested/able to do it.

Of the wikis where the message to enable citoid is present, I have seen a wide range of error:

  • Several where none of the templates it was enabled for had any template data whatsoever. ( for example, id ) This is not just an issue for citoid, but using any templates in VE whatsoever.
  • The templates had template data, but none had a citoid maps (which is necessary for it to function at all) (for example, zh)
  • Some of the templates had a citoid map, but not all of the templates in the message listed had citoid maps. (for example, fi. This particularly worries me because I remember talking with a fi editor who was very interested/involved in enabling citoid but somehow it did not get communicated that all of the listed templates needed a maps value- so points to issues with the documentation perhaps)

@Trizek-WMF I think that central repository for templates is a great idea and probably would help with this a lot. But presumably the /doc page would be local?

In one hand, having a central template will facilitate translations or maintenance. Also, a TemplateData can be created in multiple languages. on the other hand, local documentation may tent to disappear, replaced by that centralized documentation and a normalized use of the template.

From just going through all the wikis that already have citoid enabled for this task https://phabricator.wikimedia.org/T114515, it is clear that even for these wikis either a) The documentation and/or translation for enabling citoid really bad or b) They simply don't have enough people interested/able to do it.

This is a problem concerning translations and having tech communities ready to support that. Centralization may help, just as well T128790: Translation strategy – act and refine can.

Of the wikis where the message to enable citoid is present, I have seen a wide range of error:

  • Several where none of the templates it was enabled for had any template data whatsoever. ( for example, id ) This is not just an issue for citoid, but using any templates in VE whatsoever.

I would like to have more workshops about that kind in international events. That was the purpose of T137713: Discover TemplateData at Wikimania 2016's Hackathon.

  • The templates had template data, but none had a citoid maps (which is necessary for it to function at all) (for example, zh)

What is a Citoid map?

  • Some of the templates had a citoid map, but not all of the templates in the message listed had citoid maps. (for example, fi. This particularly worries me because I remember talking with a fi editor who was very interested/involved in enabling citoid but somehow it did not get communicated that all of the listed templates needed a maps value- so points to issues with the documentation perhaps)
Mvolz added a comment.EditedJul 13 2016, 2:01 PM
  • The templates had template data, but none had a citoid maps (which is necessary for it to function at all) (for example, zh)

What is a Citoid map?

  • Some of the templates had a citoid map, but not all of the templates in the message listed had citoid maps. (for example, fi. This particularly worries me because I remember talking with a fi editor who was very interested/involved in enabling citoid but somehow it did not get communicated that all of the listed templates needed a maps value- so points to issues with the documentation perhaps)

'maps' is a top level parameter with n a templatedata object, like 'description' or 'params'. The 'maps' object has to contain a 'citoid' object which tells it which template data params are equivalent to which citoid parameters; citoid doesn't work without it because then it doesn't know the names of the params to use.

A few things, FWIW.

Especially since we may be lacking manpower in some areas, we need to do what we can to make sure that if there's even just one person who can actually help with a given task, s/he has all the info s/he needs to succeed. (Some of the tasks look so complex that some people feel they should be carried out by paid staff only.)

Citoid's documentation looked so hard to process that we ended up publishing a somewhat easier version of it, which tries to go straight to the point for those who are not interested in technicalities, and is even marked for translation.
This is the page we're pointing communities to (via a "checklist" that we're also currently improving), but I haven't heard back yet about how effective, easily understandable and up-to-date it is.

Something we're also doing these days is building a community taskforce, so that people get a bit more appreciation for their hard work in certain areas, and can hopefully be of assistance to other wikimedians struggling in those same areas.
This quarter we're planning to find out exactly how much the existing docs have or have not helped them.

Qgil added a comment.Sep 28 2016, 7:29 AM

We should keep this task in mind whenever there is a hackathon or similar type of technical meeting. For instance, what is the status of Greek, and could T146327: ThessHack - Wiki Hackathon play any role here?

You don't really need to have technical knowledge to write TemplateData. Just know how to do that and good sense. :)
Writing TD cans be an activity for any meetup with willingness to improve user experience.

Qgil added a comment.Sep 28 2016, 8:45 PM

I know. In fact we have used Google Code-in to create tasks related with TemplatedData, and perhaps this is the best way forward for this task?

  1. State of el wiki citoid-wise is okay; it is installed properly: (T114515 contains list of most wikis where citoid is installed, for reference)
  2. Even so, could use translation, some of the descriptions are in English. The ones VE uses are the same as en wiki ones:
  3. I agree that it could work for this to be a Google code in thing, which I am happy to do this year, although the advantage of doing it for language specific conferences is that they can actually work on it in their language, so big plus there.
  4. Template Data has a GUI for params, but not for the citoid maps, so technically I'd argue it *is* technical, but that's a technicality. :) Both are needed so getting just the params in is a big help.
Mvolz added a comment.Oct 8 2016, 6:40 AM

ja is a good candidate for this, they use all the same templates as en wiki already and the templates have templatedata in them already, with the exception of Template:citation.

I agree that it could work for this to be a Google code in thing, which I am happy to do this year

Now is a great time to draft & propose (cloneable) Google Code-in tasks.
Who else will join as a (co-)mentor to give this a try? (Thanks to @Mvolz for already being in!)

To not reinvent the wheel: In 2014 we linked to info in https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User:Mvolz/GCI_TemplateData_Tasks in GCI tasks such as this one (ignore the look of that old site, last GCI edition has been using a new one).
Could that be (updated and) recycled?

Whatamidoing-WMF renamed this task from Consider helping some smaller Wikipedias' communities (which?) by writing the TemplateData to enable citoid for them to Consider helping some smaller Wikipedias' communities (which?) by writing the TemplateData and enabling citoid for them.Oct 24 2016, 5:13 PM
Whatamidoing-WMF updated the task description. (Show Details)

@Aklapper, I think that the "hard" parts could be done by any familiar with the local language and their citation preferences. But two of the steps (that I just added to the description) require the user to be an admin at the local site, so it will probably require assistance from either a local or global sysop.

Mvolz updated the task description. (Show Details)Oct 24 2016, 6:00 PM
Mvolz moved this task from Backlog to Zotero & External on the Citoid board.Oct 28 2016, 3:18 PM
Mvolz added a comment.EditedJan 13 2017, 2:15 PM

Have we reached a consensus on this? Is this okay to delete the "consider" and actually do it?

I have some candidates in mind and if we agree to do this would be happy to do them with my work account if that is considered acceptable.

  • jp - has all the en wiki templates already uploaded, just needs the maps value and message installed.
  • simple - also has all the appropriate en wiki templates, just needs the maps value and message installed.

I'm in favor of doing this. I have not yet seen a community object to having citoid enabled.

However, if it's necessary to import all the citation templates in step #1 (if none exist), then that step should be preceeded by a note on the local Village Pump. There may still be a few Wikipedias that do not want to use citation templates at all (and therefore cannot use the citoid service).

In the case of Simple English and Japanese Wikipedias, citation templates are already in use. It might be good to offer an update to the CS1 Lua modules. Both of these wikis seem to be using pre-Lua versions of the citation templates.

Trizek-WMF added a comment.EditedJan 18 2017, 11:54 AM

That task is still a good one for non-developers during Wikimedia Hackathons.

Mvolz renamed this task from Consider helping some smaller Wikipedias' communities (which?) by writing the TemplateData and enabling citoid for them to Help some smaller Wikipedias' communities (which?) by writing the TemplateData and enabling citoid for them.Jan 19 2017, 7:53 PM
Mvolz updated the task description. (Show Details)
Mvolz updated the task description. (Show Details)
Mvolz updated the task description. (Show Details)Jan 19 2017, 7:58 PM
Mvolz updated the task description. (Show Details)Feb 28 2017, 5:15 PM
Mvolz added a comment.Mar 1 2017, 3:49 PM

There's a related outreachy project requesting this on hu wiki: T147618

Mvolz renamed this task from Help some smaller Wikipedias' communities (which?) by writing the TemplateData and enabling citoid for them to Help some smaller Wikipedias' communities by writing the TemplateData and enabling citoid for them.Jun 29 2017, 8:36 AM
Mvolz updated the task description. (Show Details)Jul 3 2017, 11:17 AM
Ivi104 added a subscriber: Ivi104.Jul 26 2017, 6:29 AM

Good day! I would like to ask someone to please look over a request to fill MediaWiki:Visualeditor-cite-tool-definition.json on Croatian Wikipedia and to verify everything is as it should be. TemplateData for citing templates has been made. Next I would like to ask for help in enabling Citoid for hr.wiki. Thank you for your time!

Mvolz added a comment.Jul 26 2017, 4:10 PM

Good day! I would like to ask someone to please look over a request to fill MediaWiki:Visualeditor-cite-tool-definition.json on Croatian Wikipedia and to verify everything is as it should be.

Looks fine to me.

TemplateData for citing templates has been made. Next I would like to ask for help in enabling Citoid for hr.wiki. Thank you for your time!

Great, the guide for this is at https://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Citoid/Enabling_Citoid_on_your_wiki Let us know if you need any more help.