Enabling Citoid on GA Wikipedia (Vicipéid)
Open, NormalPublic

Description

Through various workshops, the lack of Citoid on GA has been flagged as a barrier to editing for new and existing editors. I have a number of Irish speakers who can assist in translation, but we would like to begin the process of implementing Citoid on Vicipéid.

Restricted Application added a project: VisualEditor. · View Herald TranscriptFeb 21 2018, 4:55 PM
Restricted Application added a subscriber: Aklapper. · View Herald Transcript
Mvolz added a subscriber: Mvolz.Feb 22 2018, 11:10 AM

That's great!

We have some directions on how to do that here:

https://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Citoid/Enabling_Citoid_on_your_wiki

Are there any citation templates on ga wiki? I had a look and I couldn't find any.

I think your best bet to start with is to import https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Template:Citation and then translate that template. Is there any one of you that has import rights that can do that?

Thank you very much! I don't think there are any citation templates on GA.

I don't have import rights, but I can check in with some other GA editors to see if anyone can do it.

Could you please explain what is wanted from Community-Liaisons here as this project was added? Thanks!

Deskana triaged this task as Normal priority.Feb 26 2018, 11:38 AM
Deskana moved this task from To Triage to External and Administrivia on the VisualEditor board.

At the moment there is no tool to insert citation in source editor, and a similar lack of a code generating tool in the visual editor. At the moment editors tend to generate the code in an EN page and then copy paste over. Anything that could help in generating the code to create citations on GA would be a huge improvement. There is also no way of reusing a citation.

It makes editing cumbersome as well as that bit more difficult for newer editors.

Mvolz moved this task from Backlog to Zotero & External on the Citoid board.Feb 26 2018, 1:30 PM
Elitre moved this task from Backlog to Team radar on the Community-Liaisons board.Mar 1 2018, 1:40 PM

@Mvolz, @Elitre: It looks like ga.wikipedia.org does have at least one citation template in use: https://ga.wikipedia.org/wiki/Teimpl%C3%A9ad:Cite_journal, which is also aliased to "Template:Cite book". I'm very skeptical of importing Template:Citation to wikis that don't have technically-proficient editors. That template has 96 other template dependencies and a dozen module dependencies, all of which are very complicated and have to be maintained by someone on that wiki. If they aren't maintained, they will gradually produce errors as MediaWiki's citation handling, module capabilities, and Wikitext parsing evolve. Wikitext parsing is especially likely to evolve over the next few years due to the Platform Evolution project and parser unification. Localizing those 100+ templates and modules is also not a trivial task (especially since many of them are explicitly designed to support English grammar). Currently ga.wikipedia has one simple, functional, easy to maintain and update citation template, which probably makes sense for them.

I imagine they will at least need to create a "cite web" template in order for Citoid to be practically useful (besides their existing cite book and cite journal). @Elitre, maybe you could ping Guliolopez and see if they would be willing to create that. Also, pinging via Phabricator: @Guliolopez.

I've created an initial Citoid mapping here: https://ga.wikipedia.org/wiki/MediaWiki:Citoid-template-type-map.json.

Mvolz added a comment.EditedApr 19 2018, 12:54 PM

I imagine they will at least need to create a "cite web" template in order for Citoid to be practically useful (besides their existing cite book and cite journal). @Elitre, maybe you could ping Guliolopez and see if they would be willing to create that. Also, pinging via Phabricator: @Guliolopez.

I've created an initial Citoid mapping here: https://ga.wikipedia.org/wiki/MediaWiki:Citoid-template-type-map.json.

Thanks @kaldari (I've actually had to blank that edit as the templates need to be fixed first. If you enable citoid without adding the appropriate template data it is very confusing for users because every time they try to use it it will just say "we couldn't make a citation for you" because the template data isn't present.

We can use Cite journal for everything instead, that is also a good solution. The important thing is to have at least one citation template :).

jrbs added a subscriber: jrbs.Apr 19 2018, 5:49 PM

Hello all, thanks so much for looking into this. There are a few admins on GA that I can ask to get involved with some of the template work, but I also have 2 newer editors who are also computer scientists who are very interested in learning how to create and then maintain templates. I know nothing about templates, so I feel like I don't personally have the skills to bring this forward on my own.
I'm currently at Wikimedia Conference in Berlin, so if there is anyone here that I could talk to, that would be fantastic.

@Smirkybec: You might try talking to @MusikAnimal (Leon) at Wikimedia Conference. He's pretty adept at template editing.

@Smirkybec: You might try talking to @MusikAnimal (Leon) at Wikimedia Conference. He's pretty adept at template editing.

Sure! A simple {{cite web}} I can help with, but obviously not importing enwiki's complicated system. I am at the conference, come find me :) This sounds like fun and rewarding work

Elitre added a comment.May 2 2018, 9:53 AM

@Mvolz, @Elitre: It looks like ga.wikipedia.org does have at least one citation template in use: https://ga.wikipedia.org/wiki/Teimpl%C3%A9ad:Cite_journal, which is also aliased to "Template:Cite book". I'm very skeptical of importing Template:Citation to wikis that don't have technically-proficient editors. That template has 96 other template dependencies and a dozen module dependencies, all of which are very complicated and have to be maintained by someone on that wiki. If they aren't maintained, they will gradually produce errors as MediaWiki's citation handling, module capabilities, and Wikitext parsing evolve. Wikitext parsing is especially likely to evolve over the next few years due to the Platform Evolution project and parser unification. Localizing those 100+ templates and modules is also not a trivial task (especially since many of them are explicitly designed to support English grammar). Currently ga.wikipedia has one simple, functional, easy to maintain and update citation template, which probably makes sense for them.

I missed this. Was progress achieved at WmCon?

Sorry I didn't find you in the end - it was a very busy con for me! As mentioned, I have 2 editors who are very keen to learn (as they would also like to work on infoboxes, or even wikidata infoboxes), but I'm not technically clued in enough to help them.