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Set Flow and LQT sunsetting timeline and sequence
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Description

This task involves the work of converging on a sequence and timeline in which the Editing Team, in collaboration with volunteers and projects, will undeploy StructuredDiscussions (Flow) and LiquidThreads (LQT). We will use the term "Flow" for both features, unless noted.

Defining the above will enable us to do things like:

  1. Decide whether new Flow-related issues warrant resolution in the time between when they emerge and when Flow will be undeployed?
  2. Coordinate with other teams to ensure the deployment plans they are making are not complicated/put at risk by Flow's deployment state

Undeployment sequence

StepDescriptionCompletion timing: Phase 0 wikisCompletion timing: Phase 1 wikisCompletion timing: Phase 2a wikisCompletion timing:Phase 2b wikis
Step #1Write script to automatically move talk pages16 October 2024
Step #2Inform volunteers/communities of deprecation plan (w/ dates)11 October 2024✅21 November 2024
Step #3Volunteers manually move Flow boards to sub-pages21 October 2024✅ until 28 November 2024
Step #4Run migration script (T376749)24 October 2024✅ scheduled 28 November 2024✅ December 17 2024tentative
Step #5Fix any migration issues28 October 2024
Step #6Set all Flow boards to read-only30 October 2024
Step #7Convert content of all archived Flow boards to wikitext (T377051)
Step 8Remove Flow code and related data

See more here: https://miro.com/app/board/uXjVKGsM740=/

Done

  • A plan that includes the following information
    • All of the wikis where Flow/StructuredDiscussions is currently active
    • For each wiki we'll have identified above the dates we're proposing for Flow to be:
      • Set into a read-only state
      • All Flow boards to be moved to sub-pages
      • Flow to be undeployed

Related Objects

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Resolvedzoe
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Event Timeline

One important step is turn off user talk page Beta Feature for each opted-in users and then disable the Beta Feature permanently.

One important step is turn off user talk page Beta Feature for each opted-in users and then disable the Beta Feature permanently.

Great spot, @Bugreporter. @Trizek-WMF and I will ensure this step is accounted for in the un-deployment sequence.

Thank you for saying something; if any other ideas of this sort emerge, we'd value you sharing them with us!

One important step is turn off user talk page Beta Feature for each opted-in users and then disable the Beta Feature permanently.

It is already covered: T248309: StructuredDiscussions (Flow): Prevent users from enabling Flow on their user talk page (beta feature) :)

One important step is turn off user talk page Beta Feature for each opted-in users and then disable the Beta Feature permanently.

It is already covered: T248309: StructuredDiscussions (Flow): Prevent users from enabling Flow on their user talk page (beta feature) :)

What I mean is disable for people currently using it in user talk page.

Update

Today, @Trizek-WMF defined three deployment phases (see below). Next, Benoît is going to:

  1. Assign each wiki where Flow is active (T350073) to one of these three un-deployment phases (see below)
  2. Estimate how much time wikis in each un-deployment phase will need for the various steps within the un-deployment sequence (e.g. manually migrating Flow boards to sub-pages, enabling a script to mass-migrate Flow boards that had not been moved manually, etc.)

In parallel, I'll be working with Editing Engineering to estimate the time needed for doing things like writing a migration script, QA'ing said script, and addressing any issues that script surfaces.

Deployment phases
PhaseDefinition
Phase 0: No FlowFlow boards are present on these wikis and Flow is no longer being actively used
Phase 1: Low FlowFlow is used on a long tail of lightly used pages
Phase 2: High FlowFlow is the default discussion system and/or used on high-traffic community pages
Trizek-WMF changed the task status from Open to In Progress.Aug 2 2024, 7:49 AM
Trizek-WMF triaged this task as High priority.
Trizek-WMF updated the task description. (Show Details)
Trizek-WMF renamed this task from Set Flow sunsetting timeline and sequence to Set Flow and LQT sunsetting timeline and sequence.Sep 11 2024, 2:58 PM
Trizek-WMF updated the task description. (Show Details)
ppelberg updated the task description. (Show Details)
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ppelberg updated the task description. (Show Details)

@ppelberg the task title mentions LiquidThreads (related T350164: Undeploy LiquidThreads), but the work here seems specific to Flow. Is there a plan/timeline for LiquidThreads as well?

@ppelberg the task title mentions LiquidThreads (related T350164: Undeploy LiquidThreads), but the work here seems specific to Flow. Is there a plan/timeline for LiquidThreads as well?

I'm on it. :)

Dates regarding Phases 1 and 2 will be discussed with the Editing team on November 13.

While deleting one of the the Topic pages on Commons, I came across this error:
[b81ebde5-b932-404b-8f19-0dd5929528a0] 2024-12-24 11:03:36: Fatal exception of type "MediaWiki\Page\PageAssertionException"

This follows after a deletion request at Commons' Admin Noticeboard about some obsolete flow topics. Feel free to move this to any appropriate place though, if it doesn't belong here. I;d say sorry in advance.

While deleting one of the the Topic pages on Commons, I came across this error:
[b81ebde5-b932-404b-8f19-0dd5929528a0] 2024-12-24 11:03:36: Fatal exception of type "MediaWiki\Page\PageAssertionException"

This follows after a deletion request at Commons' Admin Noticeboard about some obsolete flow topics. Feel free to move this to any appropriate place though, if it doesn't belong here. I;d say sorry in advance.

@ppelberg @Trizek-WMF Something is wrong here.

Please file separate tasks for separate issues; this task is about defining a timeline only.
The issue you run into ("MediaWiki\Page\PageAssertionException: The given PageIdentity Special:Badtitle/NS2601:Sn8f417nuorxes8d does not represent a proper page") is a bit similar to T339879. Thanks a lot!

@ppelberg @Pppery I have a few questions to ask:

  1. There are sites using LQT. (enwikinews, enwikitionary, huwikipedia, translatewiki) However, there aren't any phases and tasks for them. Will you create a task for processing pages of them?
  2. Some closed wikis (for example, strategy.wikimedia.org) were still using Flow or LQT until it was closed. When the extensions are eventually removed, archives in closed wikis are inaccessible anymore. It is recommended to reopen these sites temporarily to process those discussion pages.

@ppelberg @Pppery I have a few questions to ask:

  1. There are sites using LQT. (enwikinews, enwikitionary, huwikipedia, translatewiki) However, there aren't any phases and tasks for them. Will you create a task for processing pages of them?

Yes. We are finishing the work with Flow first. The work on LQT is documented on T350164: Undeploy LiquidThreads and sub-tasks.

  1. Some closed wikis (for example, strategy.wikimedia.org) were still using Flow or LQT until it was closed. When the extensions are eventually removed, archives in closed wikis are inaccessible anymore. It is recommended to reopen these sites temporarily to process those discussion pages.

I don't think we should. The entire wiki is already an archive. When the conversion of Flow/LQT contents is performed, we will replace the contents with standard talk pages.

@Trizek-WMF Well, as you have said, those closed wiki is an archive. But removing Flow directly would cause archive damage of the site. So we should fix them before being inaccessible.

On the other hand, translatewiki is not on the list on T350164.

On the other hand, translatewiki is not on the list on T350164.

Translatewiki is not a Wikimedia Foundation managed wiki (https://www.spi-inc.org/projects/translatewiki.net/).

Trizek-WMF added a subscriber: STei-WMF.

Stepping back as an assignee as @STei-WMF currently covers the removal of LiquidThreads from the wikis, which pauses the current work on Flow.