Bringing to +1 for discussion on timing for Sprint V - may move back to next after planning.

@Damilare just flagging any dependencies or issues as they relate to the donor portal - note we had concerns outlined in this phab T407527: Interim flow for Paypal recurring donors in Donor Portal cc: @KHill-WMF

Hi @AKanji-WMF, I haven't gotten feedback from PayPal yet on the requirements so I can't say just yet. I'd update this ticket when we get more understanding from PayPal about the requirements for the migration and the possibilities afterwards.

For reference @Damilare has opened Case Number:- 17252781 with Paypal cc: @EMartin - this task is currently in blocked.

@Damilare I have included our new account reps on the case to see if they can assist.

@krobinson ran into an issue today that prevented the cancellation of legacy PayPal donations in CiviCRM; logged in T418371: PayPal donation cancellation fails with "The profile ID is invalid" error. She later confirmed that this is a known issue documented here and asked if this will be fixed once we migrate PayPal recurring payments over to Gravy. I wasn't sure of the answer, so let's track it on this ticket to see what controls we get on "legacy" PayPal donations once we migrate them to Gravy, and update her accordingly.

Thanks @EMartin and @jgleeson. I had initially placed this message in the wrong phab.

PayPal's response suggests we wouldn't be able to migrate Donors from the legacy implementation to the Gravy tokens. Here's the full response for context:

I've received confirmation from the team that it is not possible to directly migrate from RPP (RecurringPaymentsProfile) to vault tokens/billing agreements. There is no automated or semi-automated migration path available.

If you'd like to move to the new vaulting system (Payment Tokens/Billing Agreements), the hybrid method is your best option

This approach avoids forcing a technical migration and allows you to phase into the new system naturally over time.

I understand this may not be the answer you were hoping for, but I wanted to give you accurate information about what's technically feasible.

This implies we would not be able to take control of the PayPal recurring unless we have the donors on the Tokens/Billing agreements.

The next possible step is to invite Donors on the legacy PayPal Recurring Payments Profile to start a new PayPal recurring via Gravy. This is because we already have Gravy setup with the new PayPal implementation and having Donors setup on Gravy would give us the required features through Gravy.

Is there any way to see volume of donors we have on Legacy still? As these are clearly loyal donors who have been giving for a long time, so we wouldn't want to risk losing their support; however, the current set up is not ideal for internal stakeholders. Getting a sense of volume would be helpful. Thanks!

Thanks @krobinson, this SK shows we currently have over 402K active recurring donations (across monthly and yearly frequency units) using the legacy integration (paypal_ec).

Thanks @Damilare

However, I believe legacy is only for PayPal donations set up before we migrated to PayPal Express Checkout (paypal_ec) - I think they are just "paypal" in Civi. Would it be able to get a count for the legacy donations without the EC ones?

@krobinson Unfortunately even with Express Checkout, we still kept creating 'Recurring Payment Profiles' rather than billing agreements / vault tokens. There are 10k still on the oldest 'S-' subscriptions representing something like $60k monthly revenue, but as I read the email even the EC recurrings are not possible to migrate.

We met with PayPal yesterday to discuss the importance of this migration and potential solutions they can offer with minimal risks. They showed an appreciation of the situation and they are looking at potentially building a solution for this to happen. We are meeting again on the 13th of April.