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Deploy sub-referencing MVP to German Wikivoyage (devoy)
Open, Stalled, Needs TriagePublicFeature

Description

Feature summary (what you would like to be able to do and where):
Since October of 2024, Parsoid is the main parser for all Wikivoyages except zhvoy. Since this time, the authors and readers of these wikis are helping to overcome Parsoid-related failures. One of the main problems are extension tags in which templates with frame arguments are used. These arguments are ignored (ie they are empty). In a few cases of seldomly used tags like indicators, a workaround replacement with {{tag:indicator | ... }} can be used. But this makes no sense for often used extension tags like <poem>. That's why a new linter category will be established soon to indicate frame arguments in extension tags (see T348722).

The test on German Wikivoyage has two aims:

  • Checking the overall functionality of sub-references with templates within the <ref> tags.
  • In case of correctness of references to prevent the addition of reference tags to the linter category mentioned.

Why the German Wikivoyage?

  • Usage of Parsoid
  • Contrary to other Wikivoyages, authors of the German Wikivoyage are engaged to use references at least for copyright reasons. But the usage is not compulsory. For this, a set of templates like {{Buch}} (cite book) are prepared. But there are already cases where the same reference(s) are used multiple times (see for instance https://de.wikivoyage.org/wiki/Siwa).
  • Templates like {{reflist}} are not used.

What happens if sub-references are failing?

  • There is only a smaller number of pages using references with templates which can show these failures. That means that these errors do not occur en masse.

Benefits (why should this be implemented?):

  • All Wikimedia wikis will benefit because Parsoid is usable at many wikis. But errors can be detected prior the preferred use of Parsoid.
  • See also at InitialiseSettings.php:
'wgCiteSubReferencing' => [
	'default' => false,
	// T395871
	'testwiki' => true,
	'test2wiki' => true,

	'dewiki' => true, // T398669
],

Event Timeline

Restricted Application added a subscriber: Aklapper. · View Herald Transcript

Hello @RolandUnger,

Thanks so much for reaching out. I think it’s a great idea to test Sub-referencing on Wikivoyage, especially since, as you pointed out, the feature needs to work well with citation templates. We haven’t done any testing on Wikivoyage yet, and we’d love to see how the feature behaves there in general.

Before we take that step, though, I wanted to make you aware of our plans moving forward, as well as the current limitations so that you can make an informed decision with regards to when you’d like us to enable the feature on German Wikivoyage.

Please also note that we are currently prioritizing work related to language Wikipedias. This means that if we discover issues that are specific to Wikivoyage only, depending on their size and complexity, they may need to wait until sometime in 2026 to be addressed.

In terms of full Parsoid support for sub-referencing, there are still some missing functionality, which we aim to complete by March ‘26 in line with the Parsoid rollout plan:

Furthermore, here’s a list of items deemed important from our perspective for a more seamless experience beyond the current pilot phase:

As you see, we are really still in the pilot phase. So in essence, my recommendation would be to wait with rolling out to Wikivoyage until we at least have full Parsoid support for sub-referencing in place (the items indicated above), since you would otherwise encounter known issues that we have already identified and plan to resolve.

I hope this is helpful, please let me know what you think and if there are any questions I can help with. Also I am happy to keep you updated on our progress.

Best regards
Lina (PM Technical Wishes)

PS: thanks for sharing the article on Siwa - I enjoyed reading it and hope to visit in the near future :)

@lina, thanks for your explanation. I thought that sub-referencing was already fully implemented.

Johannes_Richter_WMDE changed the task status from Open to Stalled.Dec 10 2025, 5:28 PM