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Cross-wiki watchlists
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bzimport
Sep 21 2005, 8:32 AM
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Description

Author: acrush

Description:
Please consider providing wikimedians with crosswiki watchlists. Such could also
be made public as an option.

See Also:

Details

Reference
bz3525

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Event Timeline

There are a very large number of changes, so older changes are hidden. Show Older Changes

Where does this stand? Where does one go to find this out?

The watchlists I want most in my crosswiki watchlist are English Wikipedia (my home wiki) plus the central ones such as MediaWiki.org, Meta, etc..
*https://www.mediawiki.org
*https://meta.wikimedia.org

There is a great need for more participatory international communication to solve common wiki problems, and to energize further wiki creativity. Right now only a relatively few people participate in Meta and Mediawiki.org due to the lack of a crosswiki watchlist.
*https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Global,_cross-wiki,_integrated_watchlists

I like opening my commons watchlist separately so that image-related stuff is not mixed in with article stuff.

And why doesn't the Wikimedia Foundation have a wiki and talk pages and a watchlist? Explains why the WMF and its staff can be so clueless at times. They are using WordPress:
*https://wikimediafoundation.org
So there is no way for open discussion there on talk pages by people using single user login from around the world. No ease of use. No anonymity. No way to easily go to a user's home page and see where they are coming from, and why they are making their comments, suggestions, etc..

Where does this stand? Where does one go to find this out?

I think https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Community_Tech/Cross-wiki_watchlist#Status was last updated in 2017. Looking through Phabricator, I think this is blocked on T158880: Finalize database implementation plan for cross-wiki watchlists? Maybe someone from Community Tech could clarify.

And why doesn't the Wikimedia Foundation have a wiki and talk pages and a watchlist? Explains why the WMF and its staff can be so clueless at times. They are using WordPress:
*https://wikimediafoundation.org
So there is no way for open discussion there on talk pages by people using single user login from around the world. No ease of use. No anonymity. No way to easily go to a user's home page and see where they are coming from, and why they are making their comments, suggestions, etc..

There's no need to make personal attacks about people being clueless. There's some discussion about the new Wikimedia Foundation website on wikimedia-l, which is a much better venue than Phabricator for those kinds of discussions.

Where does this stand? Where does one go to find this out?

I think https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Community_Tech/Cross-wiki_watchlist#Status was last updated in 2017. Looking through Phabricator, I think this is blocked on T158880: Finalize database implementation plan for cross-wiki watchlists? Maybe someone from Community Tech could clarify.

That's correct. Community Tech also currently does not have the bandwidth to take on that project with all of the other projects we have on our plate, unfortunately. :(

How is it possible that such a frequently-requested feature can be put on the back burner for so many years? It is almost always in the top ten of any survey of user requests. It was number 4 on this community wishlist:
*https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Community_Wishlist_Survey_2015/Results

Why can't the WMF make it a priority? It has plenty of money, and there are skilled developers worldwide who could be hired, and who could even work from their home country.

And why, in this day and age, are we using email lists such as wikimedia-l to discuss these issues when we have wikis? It is a catch 22 situation where we need a WMF wiki and a cross-wiki watchlist to discuss this worldwide in a real way.

@everyone - I know that there was discussion about reviving crosswatch, but that hasn't been actioned yet. I have created a user script that, in combination with GlobalCssJs, effectively creates a global watchlist. Please see https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User:DannyS712/Global_watchlist for details. Would it be possible to have such a javascript implementation bundled as a module in GlobalCssJs / would that be a good idea to consider?

DannyS712 changed the subtype of this task from "Task" to "Feature Request".Mar 29 2020, 9:04 PM

Is this done now that MediaWiki-extensions-GlobalWatchlist exists and is deployed? If so

Is this done now that MediaWiki-extensions-GlobalWatchlist exists and is deployed?

...

No offense, especially considering all the work involved. But neither of the above cross-wiki watchlists work for my needs. I wouldn't use them.

MediaWiki-extensions-GlobalWatchlist is here:
https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Special:GlobalWatchlist

I tried it out. This new watchlist is not in chronological order for me. Also, I couldn't get it to show just the last change. I played around with the settings. I set it up to show meta and English Wikipedia watchlists. Meta watchlist is above the English Wikipedia watchlist. I like that the watchlists are separate. I like that the individual watchlists can be collapsed or expanded. That is good for faster scrolling. A table of contents linking to each watchlist would make it even more usable and fast.

I would prefer getting the regular watchlists in this stacked expand/collapse format. I want to see exactly the same watchlists I am seeing when the watchlists are on separate pages. With all the settings as set on the source wiki. All those settings are important.

Not done. While I am impressed with userscript-hacks trying to work around missing functionality, it is still trying to work around our lack of a global watchlist. I am unclear on whether the current project can/will be developed into a global watchlist, or whether we need to reclaim the "globalwatchlist" name/urls for an actual global watchlist project? I'm not a fan of userstories but I'll try to put it in that form:

  1. A new user creates an account and begins editing.
  2. The user discovers a "page watch" feature exists.
  3. The user begins watching various pages, possibly on multiple wikis.
  4. The user clicks to view the watchlist.
  5. Results are shown for all watched pages, possibly on multiple wikis.
  6. The user eventually discovers preferences. They find all (or substantially-all) of the current watch options are available and functional.
  • Note: The user does not know Meta exists. They should not need to learn about or go to Meta.
  • Note: Steps 1 through 5 were default behavior, the new user had no need to learn about preferences yet.
  • Note: The user should not have to list what Wikis they want to watch - the obvious default answer is "all wikis with watched pages". If an internal list of watched-wikis is necessary then the software can automatically log a wiki as watched whenever a page is added, and log it as unwatched when the last watch on that wiki is removed. Example Use Case: Malicious individuals are attacking somebody famous across any and all of our wikis. An editor needs to watch a single page related to that famous person on each of 200 wikis - the biography in various language Wikipedias, the Commons image, the Wikidata item, maybe even a page in several languages of Wikiquote.

Perhaps this is too ambitious for a grant-project? If so, then this important core-infrastructure work should not have been offloaded as a grant project.

Is this done now that MediaWiki-extensions-GlobalWatchlist exists and is deployed?

E:GlobalWatchlist is a fantastic start, but I think there's more work to be done before we consider "cross-wiki watchlists" fully done. Now that we have something and a foundation to build on top of, it would be good to start collecting more feedback into actionable tickets/requests to figure out where to go next.

I think it makes sense to archive the old project to centralize development efforts.

<snip>

I agree with basically everything you've suggested, which is also how cross-wiki notifications works - it's integrated into the main thing and just works for everyone, nothing special needed.

Perhaps this is too ambitious for a grant-project? If so, then this important core-infrastructure work should not have been offloaded as a grant project.

Yes, expecting a single developer working on a grant to get all of that done is too ambitious. But IMO the grant is still successful in that it built a platform for future efforts to build off of. There's an imperfect thing that users can use, provide feedback on, and developers can iteratively work on improving it, rather than seeing the obstacle of needing to build a brand new thing and get it reviewed, etc.

@DannyS712 what are your future plans/next steps? Are you planning to apply for a new grant or continue as purely a volunteer or?

@DannyS712 what are your future plans/next steps? Are you planning to apply for a new grant or continue as purely a volunteer or?

I'm planning to request a new grant to continue development

@DannyS712 I would like to confirm the anticipated potential of this approach / this platform. Assuming this project gets continued grant funding and/or continued work by staff developers, do you see this realistically on a path towards the userstory described in my last post? Essentially upgrading the current watchlist to work globaly?

@DannyS712 I would like to confirm the anticipated potential of this approach / this platform. Assuming this project gets continued grant funding and/or continued work by staff developers, do you see this realistically on a path towards the userstory described in my last post? Essentially upgrading the current watchlist to work globaly?

I don't know, at this point. Sorry

@DannyS712 I would like to confirm the anticipated potential of this approach / this platform. Assuming this project gets continued grant funding and/or continued work by staff developers, do you see this realistically on a path towards the userstory described in my last post? Essentially upgrading the current watchlist to work globaly?

I don't know, at this point. Sorry

Please see T286006: Make Special:GlobalWatchlist more discoverable on non-central wikis for addressing that user story from T5525#6888987