"Text is available under the \u003Ca href=\"https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-sa/3.0/\"\u003ECreative Commons Attribution-ShareAlike License\u003C/a\u003E;\nadditional terms may apply.\nSee \u003Ca href=\"https://foundation.wikimedia.org/wiki/Terms_of_Use\"\u003ETerms of Use\u003C/a\u003E for details.","submitted":[],"errors":[],"title":"Talk:Stable interface policy","block-action-template":"","editFont":"monospace"},"topiclist":{"submitted":{"action":"view"},"errors":[],"sortby":"updated","roots":["v8xg1u6jjd92gnxu","v7uq1wrt14vb2iih"],"posts":{"v8xg1u6jjd92gnxu":["v8xg1u6jjf83kpwy"],"v8xg1u6jjh74orw2":["v8xg1u6jjh74orw2"],"vd6ntwc8o1whm3pd":["vd6ntwc8o1whm3pd"],"v7uq1wrt14vb2iih":["v7uq1wrt16uc6khl"],"v7uq1wrt18tdamgp":["v7uq1wrt18tdamgp"],"v7uwtd7htq5rfd7q":["v7ux5fgkgtczqz8o"],"v7ux4bridtg3xyun":["v7ux4bridtg3xyun"],"v8vey3f669926o9x":["v8vey3f669926o9x"],"v8vhxf6lj4zkcx79":["v8vhxf6lj4zkcx79"]},"revisions":{"v8xg1u6jjf83kpwy":{"_BC_bools":["isOriginalContent","isModerated",
"isLocked","isModeratedNotLocked","isWatched","watchable","isMaxThreadingDepth","isNewPage"],"workflowId":"v8xg1u6jjd92gnxu","articleTitle":"Topic:V8xg1u6jjd92gnxu","revisionId":"v8xg1u6jjf83kpwy","timestamp":"20191010164013","changeType":"new-post","dateFormats":[],"properties":{"topic-of-post":{"plaintext":"Legacy functions that are implicitly public due to not having visibility modifiers are not considered public by this policy"},"topic-of-post-text-from-html":{"plaintext":"Legacy functions that are implicitly public due to not having visibility modifiers are not considered public by this policy"}},"isOriginalContent":!0,"isModerated":!1,"links":{"topic-history":{"url":"//www.mediawiki.org/w/index.php?title=Topic:V8xg1u6jjd92gnxu\u0026action=history","title":"History","text":"History"},"topic":{"url":"//www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Topic:V8xg1u6jjd92gnxu","title":"topic","text":"topic"},"post":{"url":
null,"gender":"unknown","links":[],"id":null},"lastEditId":null,"previousRevisionId":null,"isLocked":!1,"isModeratedNotLocked":!1,"content":{"content":"Legacy functions that are implicitly public due to not having visibility modifiers are not considered public by this policy","format":"topic-title-html","plaintext":"Legacy functions that are implicitly public due to not having visibility modifiers are not considered public by this policy"},"watchable":!1,"replyToId":null,"postId":"v8xg1u6jjd92gnxu","isMaxThreadingDepth":!1,"creator":{"name":"Anomie","wiki":"mediawikiwiki","gender":"unknown","links":{"contribs":{"url":"/wiki/Special:Contributions/Anomie","title":"Contributions/Anomie","exists":!0,"_BC_bools":["exists"]},"userpage":{"url":"/wiki/User:Anomie","title":"Anomie","exists":!0,"_BC_bools":["exists"]},"talk":{"url":"/wiki/User_talk:Anomie","title":"User talk:Anomie","exists":!0,"_BC_bools":["exists"]}},"id":35326},"isNewPage":!1,"replies":["v8xg1u6jjh74orw2"
,"vd6ntwc8o1whm3pd"],"reply_count":2,"last_updated_readable":"11:23, 18 December 2019","last_updated":1576668221000},"v8xg1u6jjh74orw2":{"_BC_bools":["isOriginalContent","isModerated","isLocked","isModeratedNotLocked","isWatched","watchable","isMaxThreadingDepth","isNewPage"],"workflowId":"v8xg1u6jjd92gnxu","articleTitle":"Topic:V8xg1u6jjd92gnxu","revisionId":"v8xg1u6jjh74orw2","timestamp":"20191010164013","changeType":"reply","dateFormats":[],"properties":[],"isOriginalContent":!0,"isModerated":!1,"links":{"topic-history":{"url":"//www.mediawiki.org/w/index.php?title=Topic:V8xg1u6jjd92gnxu\u0026action=history","title":"History","text":"History"},"topic":{"url":"//www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Topic:V8xg1u6jjd92gnxu","title":"topic","text":"topic"},"post":{"url":"//www.mediawiki.org/w/index.php?title=Topic:V8xg1u6jjd92gnxu\u0026topic_showPostId=v8xg1u6jjh74orw2#flow-post-v8xg1u6jjh74orw2","title":"post","text":"post"},"post-revision":{"url":
"\u003Csection data-mw-section-id=\"0\" data-parsoid=\"{}\"\u003E\u003Cp data-parsoid=\"{\u0026quot;dsr\u0026quot;:[0,183,0,0]}\"\u003EUnfortunately years ago people went through and added \"public\" to most if not all of these. Same for fields declared with \u003Ccode data-parsoid=\"{\u0026quot;stx\u0026quot;:\u0026quot;html\u0026quot;,\u0026quot;dsr\u0026quot;:[122,138,6,7]}\"\u003Evar\u003C/code\u003E rather than an explicit visibility modifier.\u003C/p\u003E\u003C/section\u003E","format":"fixed-html"},"watchable":!1,"replyToId":"v8xg1u6jjd92gnxu","postId":"v8xg1u6jjh74orw2","isMaxThreadingDepth":!1,"creator":{"name":"Anomie","wiki":"mediawikiwiki","gender":"unknown","links":{"contribs":{"url":"/wiki/Special:Contributions/Anomie","title":"Contributions/Anomie","exists":!0,"_BC_bools":["exists"]},"userpage":{"url":"/wiki/User:Anomie","title":"Anomie","exists":!0,"_BC_bools":["exists"]},"talk":{"url":"/wiki/User_talk:Anomie","title":"User talk:Anomie","exists":!0,
"\u003Csection data-mw-section-id=\"0\" data-parsoid=\"{}\"\u003E\u003Cp data-parsoid=\"{\u0026quot;dsr\u0026quot;:[0,262,0,0]}\"\u003EYes. I don't think there is an easy way to fix this. Perhaps we could add something like: \u003Ci data-parsoid=\"{\u0026quot;dsr\u0026quot;:[90,261,2,2]}\"\u003Efields and functions that appear to have been marked as public without a specific need for public access may be changed to not be public, if they have no known callers\u003C/i\u003E.\u003C/p\u003E\n\n\u003Cp data-parsoid=\"{\u0026quot;dsr\u0026quot;:[264,404,0,0]}\"\u003EI'd like this for obvious reasons, but it seems a bit like a cop-out... \"we guarantee this interface is stable, unless it's inconvenient\"...\u003C/p\u003E\u003C/section\u003E","format":"fixed-html"},"watchable":!1,"replyToId":"v8xg1u6jjd92gnxu","postId":"vd6ntwc8o1whm3pd","isMaxThreadingDepth":!1,"creator":{"name":"DKinzler (WMF)","wiki":"mediawikiwiki","gender":"unknown","links":{"contribs":{"url":
"/wiki/Special:Contributions/DKinzler_(WMF)","title":"Contributions/DKinzler (WMF)","exists":!0,"_BC_bools":["exists"]},"userpage":{"url":"/wiki/User:DKinzler_(WMF)","title":"DKinzler (WMF)","exists":!0,"_BC_bools":["exists"]},"talk":{"url":"/wiki/User_talk:DKinzler_(WMF)","title":"User talk:DKinzler (WMF)","exists":!1,"_BC_bools":["exists"]}},"id":14969248},"isNewPage":!1,"replies":[]},"v7uq1wrt16uc6khl":{"_BC_bools":["isOriginalContent","isModerated","isLocked","isModeratedNotLocked","isWatched","watchable","isMaxThreadingDepth","isNewPage"],"workflowId":"v7uq1wrt14vb2iih","articleTitle":"Topic:V7uq1wrt14vb2iih","revisionId":"v7uq1wrt16uc6khl","timestamp":"20190923072903","changeType":"new-post","dateFormats":[],"properties":{"topic-of-post":{"plaintext":"Why not a part of the existing deprecation policy?"},"topic-of-post-text-from-html":{"plaintext":"Why not a part of the existing deprecation policy?"}},"isOriginalContent":!0,"isModerated":!1,"links":{"topic-history":
"title":"Legoktm","exists":!0,"_BC_bools":["exists"]},"talk":{"url":"/wiki/User_talk:Legoktm","title":"User talk:Legoktm","exists":!0,"_BC_bools":["exists"]}},"id":31711},"lastEditUser":{"name":null,"wiki":null,"gender":"unknown","links":[],"id":null},"lastEditId":null,"previousRevisionId":null,"isLocked":!1,"isModeratedNotLocked":!1,"content":{"content":"Why not a part of the existing deprecation policy?","format":"topic-title-html","plaintext":"Why not a part of the existing deprecation policy?"},"watchable":!1,"replyToId":null,"postId":"v7uq1wrt14vb2iih","isMaxThreadingDepth":!1,"creator":{"name":"Legoktm","wiki":"mediawikiwiki","gender":"male","links":{"contribs":{"url":"/wiki/Special:Contributions/Legoktm","title":"Contributions/Legoktm","exists":!0,"_BC_bools":["exists"]},"userpage":{"url":"/wiki/User:Legoktm","title":"Legoktm","exists":!0,"_BC_bools":["exists"]},"talk":{"url":"/wiki/User_talk:Legoktm","title":"User talk:Legoktm","exists":!0,"_BC_bools":[
"exists"]}},"id":31711},"isNewPage":!1,"replies":["v7uq1wrt18tdamgp","v7uwtd7htq5rfd7q","v7ux4bridtg3xyun","v8vey3f669926o9x","v8vhxf6lj4zkcx79"],"reply_count":5,"last_updated_readable":"19:41, 9 October 2019","last_updated":1570650064000},"v7uq1wrt18tdamgp":{"_BC_bools":["isOriginalContent","isModerated","isLocked","isModeratedNotLocked","isWatched","watchable","isMaxThreadingDepth","isNewPage"],"workflowId":"v7uq1wrt14vb2iih","articleTitle":"Topic:V7uq1wrt14vb2iih","revisionId":"v7uq1wrt18tdamgp","timestamp":"20190923072903","changeType":"reply","dateFormats":[],"properties":[],"isOriginalContent":!0,"isModerated":!1,"links":{"topic-history":{"url":"//www.mediawiki.org/w/index.php?title=Topic:V7uq1wrt14vb2iih\u0026action=history","title":"History","text":"History"},"topic":{"url":"//www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Topic:V7uq1wrt14vb2iih","title":"topic","text":"topic"},"post":{"url":
"\u003Csection data-mw-section-id=\"0\" data-parsoid=\"{}\"\u003E\u003Cp data-parsoid=\"{\u0026quot;dsr\u0026quot;:[0,128,0,0]}\"\u003EWhat's the advantage of having a separate policy for this? Why not integrate the new stuff into the existing deprecation policy?\u003C/p\u003E\u003C/section\u003E","format":"fixed-html"},"watchable":!1,"replyToId":"v7uq1wrt14vb2iih","postId":"v7uq1wrt18tdamgp","isMaxThreadingDepth":!1,"creator":{"name":"Legoktm","wiki":"mediawikiwiki","gender":"male","links":{"contribs":{"url":"/wiki/Special:Contributions/Legoktm","title":"Contributions/Legoktm","exists":!0,"_BC_bools":["exists"]},"userpage":{"url":"/wiki/User:Legoktm","title":"Legoktm","exists":!0,"_BC_bools":["exists"]},"talk":{"url":"/wiki/User_talk:Legoktm","title":"User talk:Legoktm","exists":!0,"_BC_bools":["exists"]}},"id":31711},"isNewPage":!0,"replies":[]},"v7ux5fgkgtczqz8o":{"_BC_bools":["isOriginalContent","isModerated","isLocked","isModeratedNotLocked","isWatched","watchable",
"previousRevisionId":"v7uwtd7htq5rfd7q","isLocked":!1,"isModeratedNotLocked":!1,"content":{"content":"\u003Csection data-mw-section-id=\"0\" data-parsoid=\"{}\"\u003E\u003Cp data-parsoid=\"{\u0026quot;dsr\u0026quot;:[0,255,0,0]}\"\u003EBecause it's long, and defining what's stable is different from defining how to change stable things. The primary audience for the deprecation policy are core developers, while the primary audience for the stable interface policy are extension developers.\u003C/p\u003E\n\n\u003Cp data-parsoid=\"{\u0026quot;dsr\u0026quot;:[257,380,0,0]}\"\u003EI'm not totally opposed to having a single policy, but I think it's less clear. And RFC is needed for adoption in any case.\u003C/p\u003E\u003C/section\u003E","format":"fixed-html"},"watchable":!1,"replyToId":"v7uq1wrt14vb2iih","postId":"v7uwtd7htq5rfd7q","isMaxThreadingDepth":!1,"creator":{"name":"DKinzler (WMF)","wiki":"mediawikiwiki","gender":"unknown","links":{"contribs":{"url":
"isModeratedNotLocked":!1,"content":{"content":"\u003Csection data-mw-section-id=\"0\" data-parsoid=\"{}\"\u003E\u003Cp data-parsoid=\"{\u0026quot;dsr\u0026quot;:[0,134,0,0]}\"\u003EIf we only have one policy, I think it should be called \"Stable Interface Policy\", and the deprecation process would be part of that. \u003C/p\u003E\n\n\u003Cp data-parsoid=\"{\u0026quot;dsr\u0026quot;:[136,366,0,0]}\"\u003EBecause, as a new extension developer, \"stable interface policy\" sounds like something I should look at (I want to use stable interfaces), but \"deprecation policy\" doesn't sound so interesting (I don't want to deprecate anything).\u003C/p\u003E\u003C/section\u003E","format":"fixed-html"},"watchable":!1,"replyToId":"v7uq1wrt14vb2iih","postId":"v7ux4bridtg3xyun","isMaxThreadingDepth":!1,"creator":{"name":"DKinzler (WMF)","wiki":"mediawikiwiki","gender":"unknown","links":{"contribs":{"url":"/wiki/Special:Contributions/DKinzler_(WMF)","title":"Contributions/DKinzler (WMF)",
"\u003Csection data-mw-section-id=\"0\" data-parsoid=\"{}\"\u003E\u003Cp data-parsoid=\"{\u0026quot;dsr\u0026quot;:[0,167,0,0]}\"\u003EI agree we should not be enacting a new policy. It is a new RFC for sure, but its outcome should be to revise the deprecation policy including possibly a rename of it.\u003C/p\u003E\n\n\u003Cp data-parsoid=\"{\u0026quot;dsr\u0026quot;:[169,499,0,0]}\"\u003EThe main part I currently find difficult in reviewing this draft is that it is unclear what is meant to be \"new\" or \"different\" from what we have. Perhaps we can update the draft to be a complete version of the policy, with the task outlining a (short) summary what what we intend to add or change (e.g. the effective difference).\u003C/p\u003E\u003C/section\u003E","format":"fixed-html"},"watchable":!1,"replyToId":"v7uq1wrt14vb2iih","postId":"v8vey3f669926o9x","isMaxThreadingDepth":!1,"creator":{"name":"Krinkle","wiki":"mediawikiwiki","gender":"unknown","links":{"contribs":{"url":
"isModeratedNotLocked":!1,"content":{"content":"\u003Csection data-mw-section-id=\"0\" data-parsoid=\"{}\"\u003E\u003Cp data-parsoid=\"{\u0026quot;dsr\u0026quot;:[0,155,0,0]}\"\u003ESo, which do you prefer - an deprecation policy with a section on stable interfaces, or a stable interface policy with a section on deprecation procedures?\u003C/p\u003E\u003C/section\u003E","format":"fixed-html"},"watchable":!1,"replyToId":"v7uq1wrt14vb2iih","postId":"v8vhxf6lj4zkcx79","isMaxThreadingDepth":!1,"creator":{"name":"DKinzler (WMF)","wiki":"mediawikiwiki","gender":"unknown","links":{"contribs":{"url":"/wiki/Special:Contributions/DKinzler_(WMF)","title":"Contributions/DKinzler (WMF)","exists":!0,"_BC_bools":["exists"]},"userpage":{"url":"/wiki/User:DKinzler_(WMF)","title":"DKinzler (WMF)","exists":!0,"_BC_bools":["exists"]},"talk":{"url":"/wiki/User_talk:DKinzler_(WMF)","title":"User talk:DKinzler (WMF)","exists":!1,"_BC_bools":["exists"]}},"id":14969248},"isNewPage":!1,
"replies":[]}},"workflowId":"v7uq1wrt12w9ygjd","title":"Talk:Stable interface policy","actions":{"newtopic":{"url":"//www.mediawiki.org/w/index.php?title=Talk:Stable_interface_policy\u0026action=new-topic","title":"Start a new topic","text":"Start a new topic"}},"links":{"board-sort":{"updated":"/w/index.php?title=Talk:Stable_interface_policy\u0026topiclist_sortby=updated\u0026topiclist_savesortby=1","newest":"/w/index.php?title=Talk:Stable_interface_policy\u0026topiclist_sortby=newest\u0026topiclist_savesortby=1"},"newtopic":"/w/index.php?title=Talk:Stable_interface_policy\u0026action=new-topic","pagination":[]},"type":"topiclist","block-action-template":"","editToken":null,"editFont":"monospace"}},"isWatched":!1,"watchable":!1,"links":{"watch-board":{"url":"/w/index.php?title=Talk:Stable_interface_policy\u0026action=watch"},"unwatch-board":{"url":"/w/index.php?title=Talk:Stable_interface_policy\u0026action=unwatch"}},"toc":{"submitted":{"action":"view","toconly":!0,"limit":50
,"sortby":"updated"},"errors":[],"sortby":"updated","type":"topiclist","roots":["v8xg1u6jjd92gnxu","v7uq1wrt14vb2iih"],"posts":{"v8xg1u6jjd92gnxu":["v8xg1u6jjf83kpwy"],"v7uq1wrt14vb2iih":["v7uq1wrt16uc6khl"]},"revisions":{"v8xg1u6jjf83kpwy":{"content":{"content":"Legacy functions that are implicitly public due to not having visibility modifiers are not considered public by this policy","format":"topic-title-wikitext","plaintext":"Legacy functions that are implicitly public due to not having visibility modifiers are not considered public by this policy"},"last_updated":1576668221000,"isModerated":!1},"v7uq1wrt16uc6khl":{"content":{"content":"Why not a part of the existing deprecation policy?","format":"topic-title-wikitext","plaintext":"Why not a part of the existing deprecation policy?"},"last_updated":1570650064000,"isModerated":!1}},"links":{"pagination":[]}}},"wgEditSubmitButtonLabelPublish":!0,"wgCentralAuthMobileDomain":!1};RLSTATE={"ext.gadget.site-styles":"ready",
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<articleclass="flow-post-content mw-parser-output"><sectiondata-mw-section-id="0"data-parsoid="{}"><pdata-parsoid="{"dsr":[0,183,0,0]}">Unfortunately years ago people went through and added "public" to most if not all of these. Same for fields declared with <codedata-parsoid="{"stx":"html","dsr":[122,138,6,7]}">var</code> rather than an explicit visibility modifier.</p></section></article>
<articleclass="flow-post-content mw-parser-output"><sectiondata-mw-section-id="0"data-parsoid="{}"><pdata-parsoid="{"dsr":[0,262,0,0]}">Yes. I don't think there is an easy way to fix this. Perhaps we could add something like: <idata-parsoid="{"dsr":[90,261,2,2]}">fields and functions that appear to have been marked as public without a specific need for public access may be changed to not be public, if they have no known callers</i>.</p>
<pdata-parsoid="{"dsr":[264,404,0,0]}">I'd like this for obvious reasons, but it seems a bit like a cop-out... "we guarantee this interface is stable, unless it's inconvenient"...</p></section></article>
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<articleclass="flow-post-content mw-parser-output"><sectiondata-mw-section-id="0"data-parsoid="{}"><pdata-parsoid="{"dsr":[0,128,0,0]}">What's the advantage of having a separate policy for this? Why not integrate the new stuff into the existing deprecation policy?</p></section></article>
<articleclass="flow-post-content mw-parser-output"><sectiondata-mw-section-id="0"data-parsoid="{}"><pdata-parsoid="{"dsr":[0,255,0,0]}">Because it's long, and defining what's stable is different from defining how to change stable things. The primary audience for the deprecation policy are core developers, while the primary audience for the stable interface policy are extension developers.</p>
<pdata-parsoid="{"dsr":[257,380,0,0]}">I'm not totally opposed to having a single policy, but I think it's less clear. And RFC is needed for adoption in any case.</p></section></article>
<articleclass="flow-post-content mw-parser-output"><sectiondata-mw-section-id="0"data-parsoid="{}"><pdata-parsoid="{"dsr":[0,134,0,0]}">If we only have one policy, I think it should be called "Stable Interface Policy", and the deprecation process would be part of that. </p>
<pdata-parsoid="{"dsr":[136,366,0,0]}">Because, as a new extension developer, "stable interface policy" sounds like something I should look at (I want to use stable interfaces), but "deprecation policy" doesn't sound so interesting (I don't want to deprecate anything).</p></section></article>
<articleclass="flow-post-content mw-parser-output"><sectiondata-mw-section-id="0"data-parsoid="{}"><pdata-parsoid="{"dsr":[0,167,0,0]}">I agree we should not be enacting a new policy. It is a new RFC for sure, but its outcome should be to revise the deprecation policy including possibly a rename of it.</p>
<pdata-parsoid="{"dsr":[169,499,0,0]}">The main part I currently find difficult in reviewing this draft is that it is unclear what is meant to be "new" or "different" from what we have. Perhaps we can update the draft to be a complete version of the policy, with the task outlining a (short) summary what what we intend to add or change (e.g. the effective difference).</p></section></article>
<articleclass="flow-post-content mw-parser-output"><sectiondata-mw-section-id="0"data-parsoid="{}"><pdata-parsoid="{"dsr":[0,155,0,0]}">So, which do you prefer - an deprecation policy with a section on stable interfaces, or a stable interface policy with a section on deprecation procedures?</p></section></article>
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