MediaWiki Should Have a Stated Principle of Accommodating as Many People As Possible
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	Machineghost
	Sep 15 2019, 5:22 PM

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The MediaWiki Principles page (https://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Principles) acknowledges that it is a work in progress. I think there is a very clear principle missing from it.

Wikis are an inherently populist mechanism. The original wiki, Wikipedia, was defined by it's taking of content once reserved for "experts" (encyclopedia publishers) and "democratizing it". Everything about wikis, by their nature, is about increasing access to knowledge.

Furthermore, if you read any documentation about Wikipedia, or wikis in general, the language used is always "we", "all", "everyone", etc. There is a very clear communal and inclusive nature to wikis.

As such, I believe that the MediaWiki Principles page should include, as one of its principles, the following (or some version of it):

MediaWiki is:
...*existing principles* ...
for everyone

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Mentioned In: T232285: How to use Babel.js with MediaWiki Javascript
Mentioned Here: T232285: How to use Babel.js with MediaWiki Javascript

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Machineghost created this task.Sep 15 2019, 5:22 PM

Restricted Application added a subscriber: Aklapper. · View Herald TranscriptSep 15 2019, 5:22 PM

Machineghost updated the task description. (Show Details)Sep 15 2019, 5:22 PM

Machineghost updated the task description. (Show Details)

Machineghost mentioned this in T232285: How to use Babel.js with MediaWiki Javascript.

I should note that there are some within the MediaWiki organization who believe this should instead state:

for everyone with a modern web browser (as defined by those people)

I hope the whole organization doesn't feel this way, as I truly believe wikis should be for everyone, and that the original/best wiki software should support this core nature of wikis.

Machineghost updated the task description. (Show Details)Sep 15 2019, 5:30 PM

Machineghost updated the task description. (Show Details)

Reedy added a project: MediaWiki-General.Sep 15 2019, 5:31 PM

Krenair subscribed.Sep 15 2019, 5:32 PM

You probably meant the Wikimedia movement when you wrote "MediaWiki organization". :)

This task sounds unrealistic as it boils down to an expectation that maintainers should accept (and maintain forever) every potential single use case that someone could ever come up with. Hence I am declining this task.

Please feel free to discuss your change on the talk page of the wiki page to which you refer.

I just want to be clear: you're rejecting the principle that MediaWiki is for everyone because ... of a very specific interpretation (evidently that saying "MediaWiki is for everyone" = "MediaWiki must support Internet Explorer 0.1").

Is that correct?

And also, was the MediaWiki project not a result of the Wikipedia movement?

My previous comment referred to the technical context of T232285, a task which you created.

I'm going change the status of this task to invalid as that is more correct: This task is about changing some words on some wiki page which anyone can edit, and we usually don't create Phabricator tasks for small on-wiki content changes.

I neither "rejected" nor agreed on "the principle that MediaWiki is for everyone" here, but I can imagine that our interpretation of the meaning might differ.

Machineghost added a comment.Sep 15 2019, 6:59 PM

This comment was removed by Machineghost.

Well, it really seemed to me that changing the principles of an organization might warrant some institutional thought (eg. in the form of a ticket), but hey if not I'll just add it.

In T232953#5494260, @Machineghost wrote:

By that logic I disagree with the Principle:

the platform for the Wikimedia movement.

Feel free to discuss that on the talk page of https://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Talk:Principles with Wikimedia community members who created or edited that page. Also note that these Wikimedia community members might not necessarily be MediaWiki software developers or maintainers, as anyone can create and edit wiki pages.

In T232953#5494264, @Machineghost wrote:

Well, it really seemed to me that changing the principles of an organization might warrant some institutional thought

"MediaWiki" is not an organization. It is a piece of software.
See https://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Differences_between_Wikipedia,_Wikimedia,_MediaWiki,_and_wiki for more context.

MediaWiki Should Have a Stated Principle of Accommodating as Many People As PossibleClosed, InvalidPublicActions

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MediaWiki Should Have a Stated Principle of Accommodating as Many People As Possible
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