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Always display and prompt the user to fill in all required and suggested parameters for existing templates, regardless of what has been set in the wikitext
Closed, ResolvedPublic8 Estimated Story Points

Description

See T96000#1575882 , which also happens elsewhere.

Event Timeline

Elitre raised the priority of this task from to Needs Triage.
Elitre updated the task description. (Show Details)
Elitre added projects: VisualEditor, TemplateData.
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Jdforrester-WMF changed the task status from Open to Stalled.Jan 19 2016, 8:15 PM
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I don't understand what's being asked. We do automatically populate each one when the template is created.

Elitre claimed this task.

When I filed this task (and even before, as Sherry's screenshot shows), not all the required and suggested parameters were immediately displayed.

I need to change the title of this task to make it more clear.
Say you add a Google book reference with Citoid, and then you want to add other information to the Cite book template you're generating. The template inspector will list all the parameters which have already been filled, but it won't list empty "suggested" fields.
When you add a Cite book template manually, everything works as expected.

Elitre renamed this task from Display all the required and suggested parameters for a template, rather than just some of them to Display all the required and suggested parameters for a Cite template added with Citoid, rather than just some of them.Jan 21 2016, 5:46 PM
Elitre added a project: Citoid.
Jdforrester-WMF renamed this task from Display all the required and suggested parameters for a Cite template added with Citoid, rather than just some of them to Always display and prompt the user to fill in all required and suggested parameters for existing templates, regardless of what has been set in the wikitext.Jan 26 2016, 8:09 PM
Jdforrester-WMF removed a project: Citoid.

Oh, I see. This is nothing to do with Citoid; this is about parameter prompting behaviour when editing templates, which we don't do the way you suggest we should.

I think this could be quite irritating for users (open a template, change nothing, be complained at), but maybe we should change to do it.

Jdforrester-WMF triaged this task as Medium priority.
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Jdforrester-WMF moved this task from To Triage to Freezer on the VisualEditor board.
  1. A Citoid generated reference is a new reference
  2. Suggested markers in TemplateData indicate that if at all possible you will probably want to fill these fields when creating a new reference
  3. Citoid inserter does nothing with suggested flag of TemplateData
  4. New reference has fewer information than a human might have been able to supply and the user was not educated that there might be more data that should be supplied.
  5. Even if he does learn and wants to provide more data, the edit dialog will never help him anymore, and he needs to know these params by name.

I think this could be quite irritating for users (open a template, change nothing, be complained at), but maybe we should change to do it

I agree, but that's why people probably added Citoid to this.. The point is not that people want to edit an existing reference, they want to insert a new reference, but they have to resort to edit, because the Citoid inserter isn't serving their needs. That sounds like a broken use case to me.

How about the following idea:
After automatic's Generate, but before clicking the Insert-button, have a line below the preview noting: This template advices you to enter information for # more optional fields. If you click enter, it opens the editor in 'new reference'-mode (instead of edit mode), with the Citoid retrieved information prefilled and the suggested fields visible.

P.S. I just noted how terribly narrow and short (height) the reference edit-dialog is on a big screen... /me wanted to instantly resize (and actually my unconscious response was to resize the window, which didn't work of course...).

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I think this could be quite irritating for users (open a template, change nothing, be complained at), but maybe we should change to do it.

I agree it could irritate users (I'm one of them). Every time I edit a "Cite web" or "Cite news" template on en.wikipedia.org, I find the diff added first= and last= and many other empty parameters. You can manually delete them, and verify through "Review my changes" before saving, but other than through wikitext diff preview, it is hard to verify because even within the same session, re-opening the template dialog shows them again (and require re-removing again).

The issues with this behaviour is being discussed at T101075. Closing this task because (somehow) between last year and now, it did end up implemented the way this task suggests.

Jdforrester-WMF changed the point value for this task from 1 to 8.Dec 13 2017, 5:51 PM