I meet today with @LuisV_WMF and @MBrar.WMF to discuss the process proposed at https://wikitech.wikimedia.org/wiki/Talk:Volunteer_NDA

We agreed that this looks like a decent translation of the current ad-hoc process (if these two words can coexist), only simpler and faster, not requiring cryptic access to RT, attachments in emails, printed paper or pen signatures. They will try the prototype in phab-01 (linked from the URL above) and I encourage the rest of you to do the same, if only to get other users besides myself running through it.

I will propose this task as part of ECT's November sprint, although there is a dependency on T656: Enable Legalpad that I will need to discuss first with our Phabricator team.

Hi Quim,

so in RT we have "#8227: Define the RT process for volunteer NDAs" RT #8227 (https://rt.wikimedia.org/Ticket/Display.html?id=8227) still open.

What should we do with that one? Just close it in favor of this one, because phab replaces RT. Or, just wait until it's being imported, then merge into this? Other?

You can close it, and if we don't forget, we can merge it anyway when it lands here.

In T655#20038, @Qgil wrote:

You can close it, and if we don't forget, we can merge it anyway when it lands here.

Thank you Quim. done and closed, linked to here.

@LuisV_WMF, @Dzahn, @RobLa-WMF, you should be able to access {L2}, which is just a copy of https://wikitech.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:Volunteer_Non-disclosure_Agreement_Template.pdf with this change:

and _________________________________ ("Volunteer”) 

and the undersigning contributor ("Volunteer”)

I need your OK (among other things listed in the description of this task). One important detail, I have been assuming the these volunteers will join WMF-NDA, but this also needs an explicit approval.

Also, I need a couple of volunteers to test this process, just for fun. Comment here and follow https://wikitech.wikimedia.org/wiki/Talk:Volunteer_NDA . We will go through all the steps as in real life -- except in the final point of joining WMF-NDA.

PS: Can View policy == can sign, and this is the only reason why L2 is not publicly visible.

@Qgil I can test the proccess if you wish.

@Matanya, great! Please go to https://wikitech.wikimedia.org/wiki/Talk:Volunteer_NDA#Create_a_request and follow the instructions. Just a dummy request CCing a couple of real WMF employees (who will also join the test) is ok. The idea is that the process is so clear that you don't need anything from me. :)

Test successful!

In T85168#942008, @Qgil wrote:

The part that was really was testing was the access to the Legalpad and it signature. I noticed the bits of the process that need better documentation, and I will work on it. We can always keep polishing details case by case. All in all, this process is already a big improvement.

T84818 needs a NDA confirmation please

also T85170 please

So we have pretty much phased out RT and the existing process in the wiki mandated queues that are not in use anymore. I updated (unilaterial) the page here: https://wikitech.wikimedia.org/wiki/Volunteer_NDA

This essentially tells people to make an ops ticket, ops will review and make private if they have a real need for access, to CC qgil and lvilla, and to attach their NDA once the ticket has been triaged as private.

Without updating this page it was way, way wrong. I hope it is just less wrong now. Please someone with legal and/or community context help make this better.

@chasemp, did you see the process described at https://wikitech.wikimedia.org/wiki/Talk:Volunteer_NDA ? Any reason to bypass that?

In T655#964236, @Qgil wrote:

@chasemp, did you see the process described at https://wikitech.wikimedia.org/wiki/Talk:Volunteer_NDA ? Any reason to bypass that?

Nope, didn't know that was there. If you want to replace one with other I have really no idea what's right, but the existing page was horribly abysmally wrong and nothing linked to the Talk page so updating things to the best of my ability seemed the thing to do.

Although I will say it seems that doesn't address attached NDA privacy, or even how to send in the NDA itself. I know if I was signing that with my full name and signature I would not want it out in the open. I think there is also a place for address?

In T655#964250, @chasemp wrote:

I think there is also a place for address?

Yeah, the NDA documents (paper version) have a place to put your address next to the WMF's legal mailing address. I'm not sure about the one Phab has though.

@chasemp, we have been discussing and testing that process for a while now, and basically it is just waiting the official blessing of Legal (they ok'ed it verbally when I presented it to Luis, months ago).

There is no sending of NDA. There is no email, etc, just a checkbox. That was the whole point of needing Legalpad here.

Really, I'm only waiting for @LuisV_WMF's OK to close this task as Resolved and make the new process official. See the description and the discussion

Sounds good to me if that is cool with legal. I wasn't trying to redefine the process, what is there now is basically the old idea in the new system. Before what was there was a dead end.

Ok, but let's agree that the first NDA request we receive needs to go through the new Legalpad-based process. Luis will need to vet it anyway, so it will be overall less work to complete this task for good.

I have updated https://wikitech.wikimedia.org/wiki/Volunteer_NDA

Now THIS is the process.

Feedback and fine tuning is still welcome. We might find details as real requests come by. I will leave this task open until the end of February, just in case.

So we still don't have @LuisV_WMF's approval for this task. Which means this is not really legal approved yet?

WMF-Legal has not approved this process formally yet, but I believe this is only because Luis has been so busy (he had this task assigned with High priority for several weeks). He has been part of this idea of using Legalpad to handle the Volunteer NDA process, he knows the situation, and hopefully will bless it officially when we have the first case.

It appears to be assigned to you, Quim? (Unless I'm misreading Phab?)

I need @MBrar.WMF to take the lead on approving this right now - Manprit, please take a look and let me know if you have questions/need context.

The overall process looks good and is approved. I'm glad you have a director approving all final requests. The only thing we would like to change is the content of the actual NDA being signed.

Jacob and I are working on a new NDA that will hopefully read better than the one linked to here. We should have a final version for review by Luis by the end of next week. I hope that works with your timeline.

@Qgil We are finalizing the NDA language now. The way it is formatted now requires someone from WMF to fill in an appendix with a sentence or two about, 1) the purpose of the NDA (why is this person being granted access to Confidential Information), and 2) listing specific confidential information that they will have access to. Would it be possible to customize these agreements using this process? Or, does this process require one standard document that can just be signed by everyone? If it's the latter, we can reformat the NDA. Thanks!

@MBrar.WMF Legalpad doesn't offer any customization. The main use case is signing a Contributors License Agreement: a piece of text with one checkbox.

We can have different Legalpad documents though, and point different types of contributors to different documents, if the differences are worth the hassle and maintenance.

Thanks @Qgil for that additional information! We've finalized the text of the NDA so that it only really requires signatures and the date at the bottom. See

What format would you need the document in to be able to implement it?

Good! @MBrar.WMF, as said above, since you are a member of WMF-Legal, you can edit the agreement directly at L2 ("Manage Document").

@MBrar.WMF edited he text, and I think everything is good to go. Thank you everybody!

@Dzahn What still needs to be done to resolve this task?

https://wikitech.wikimedia.org/wiki/Volunteer_NDA currently say "THIS PROCESS IS UNDER LEGAL REVIEW AND IS CURRENTLY INACTIVE", but it seems it is being followed. May I be so bold to change that?

Process as I understand it currently and as it is approved by legal

https://wikitech.wikimedia.org/w/index.php?title=Volunteer_NDA&oldid=153688