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Establish communication channel for Quibble development (plot twist: Slack channel)
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End result we have picked irc.libera.chat channel #wikimedia-quibble


I am still trying to properly lead the Quibble development and I can't tell I have been very efficient in creating a proper dynamic. @kostajh @awight and @hashar recently resumed weekly meetings which helps settling up decisions. I definitely have troubles allocating proper time to move the project forward and I am surely a review bottleneck.

There is probably a few people who might be interested in following the development in an asynchronous way, and I suspect that if we have a backlog that is easily readable by others, it might spurt interest in jumping into Quibble development to enhance it.

So this task is about creating a communication channels that could be used asynchronously and synchronously. My thoughts:

  • Phabricator task such as this one is great for async communication, but lack some dynamic
  • Visio conferences are great for sync work and discussion, we should keep those.
  • A mailling list would fit the need of async comm, but I am pretty sure we all already receive too many emails
  • IRC is excellent for sync communication but lacks backlog

Or to put it in a table:

MediumSyncAsync
Phabricator tasknoYES
Mailling listnoYES
Visio conferencesYESno
IRCYESno

So well I am tempted to have a dedicated Slack channel. It has lot of benefits from mailing list (threaded conversations) and is almost appropriate for small sync communication as long as there are not too many people.

The Wikimedia Foundation has a Slack workspace and we can invite persons outside of the WMF (@awight , @Addshore or others from WMDE). Maybe that will help attracts MediaWiki developers as well and get them familiar with the tool.

Thoughts?

Event Timeline

(feel free to unsubscribe from this task since I have added anyone that proposed a patch to Quibble).

Use of Slack is exclusionary as it forces users to agree to their privacy-infringing TOS and use non-free software. IRC is universal and accessible, except as your table explains, doesn't work well for async communication. I would instead recommend using a Matrix.org channel, which:

  • Is a standardized protocol, requiring no proprietary software.
  • You can see all history, even from before you joined the channel. You don't have to be online all the time/use a bouncer like IRC, you'll get the messages you missed when you reconnect.
  • Mobile apps, web client, various desktop apps, etc.
  • It's straightforward to bridge it to IRC for people who still prefer that.

MWStake has been using Matrix for a while, and I've recently been setting up other Matrix rooms bridged to IRC channels, I'd be happy to help set up a room for Quibble as well. I find it works well for async communication in that you can easily go back and reply to messages from when you were offline but also facilitates live, sync conversation.

I generally use a Matrix client, to which I've bridged all my IRC and slack channels. So @Legoktm's solution would work for me. However, I will note that the matrix bridges (I don't think it's just my matrix client) are quite unstable. My matrix ID is currently banned from #mediawiki-parsoid on IRC for no reason I can tell, the slack channels randomly stop updating, etc.

So, as much as I generally stand with @Legoktm on the matter of freedom here, I also wouldn't mind "just" having a slack channel. I have to pick my battles, and wrestling with my chat clients isn't high on my list of OKRs.

Anyway, whatever you decide, sign me up.

I generally use a Matrix client, to which I've bridged all my IRC and slack channels. So @Legoktm's solution would work for me. However, I will note that the matrix bridges (I don't think it's just my matrix client) are quite unstable. My matrix ID is currently banned from #mediawiki-parsoid on IRC for no reason I can tell, the slack channels randomly stop updating, etc.

So, as much as I generally stand with @Legoktm on the matter of freedom here, I also wouldn't mind "just" having a slack channel. I have to pick my battles, and wrestling with my chat clients isn't high on my list of OKRs.

Anyway, whatever you decide, sign me up.

+1 to the above.

That said, maybe for now #wikimedia-quibble on IRC is the easiest thing to do for now? It would have less noise than #wikimedia-releng which would make following conversations across hours/days much easier. No threading, but that's probably OK with the current pace of development?

I have missed this task. I have since got an IRC bouncer (irc cloud) so I can use IRC as an async communication channel.

Guess we can go with #wikimedia-quibble to split out from the spam that #wikimedia-releng has ?

I have missed this task. I have since got an IRC bouncer (irc cloud) so I can use IRC as an async communication channel.

Guess we can go with #wikimedia-quibble to split out from the spam that #wikimedia-releng has ?

Yeah sounds like a good starting point, then later we can see if we need something further.

I have created the IRC #wikimedia-quibble channel following the documentation at https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/IRC/Instructions#New_channel_setup I have reached out to #wikimedia-ops to verify the creation.

Change 734561 had a related patch set uploaded (by Hashar; author: Hashar):

[labs/tools/wikibugs2@master] Add #wikimedia-quibble

https://gerrit.wikimedia.org/r/734561

Change 734563 had a related patch set uploaded (by Hashar; author: Hashar):

[wikimedia/irc/ircservserv-config@master] Add #wikimedia-quibble

https://gerrit.wikimedia.org/r/734563

Change 734563 merged by jenkins-bot:

[wikimedia/irc/ircservserv-config@master] Add #wikimedia-quibble

https://gerrit.wikimedia.org/r/734563

Got assistance from #wikimedia-ops to add a few helpful bots such as ircserserv-wm to manage channel rights or wmopbot2 to kick/ban offenders. Left to do is the wikibugs routing.

hashar changed the task status from Open to In Progress.Oct 26 2021, 9:03 AM
hashar claimed this task.

Change 734561 merged by jenkins-bot:

[labs/tools/wikibugs2@master] Add #wikimedia-quibble

https://gerrit.wikimedia.org/r/734561

Wikibugs got reloaded I think marking this resolved will make it join the channel and indeed complete the task.