Page MenuHomePhabricator

Allow mentor talk pages to be protected from non-mentees
Open, Needs TriagePublic

Description

Several arwiki mentors protected their talk page for vandalism (@Dyolf77_WMF would know more about why). However, that prevents them from being a mentor, because mentees can't conact the mentor at all, since their talk page is protected. I workarounded that via https://ar.wikipedia.org/wiki/%D8%AE%D8%A7%D8%B5:%D9%85%D8%B1%D8%B4%D8%AD_%D8%A7%D9%84%D8%A5%D8%B3%D8%A7%D8%A1%D8%A9/176 for one mentor, which allows only mentorship question through.

@MMiller_WMF proposed an abusefilter, which would see if the newcomer is trying to edit their mentor's talk page.

We can implement that by injecting a mentor_name variable to abusefilter, and use that in the abusefilter I created. However, that would mean the new abusefilter variable would be public, so we would reveal the connection between mentees and mentors to the public (albeit not in a very visible way).

Related: T244258: Homepage: Treat mentors with protected talk pages as unavailable

Event Timeline

@Daimona Please correct me if it's possible to add a variable that doesn't show in the examine outputs. Also, your advice on AbuseFilter would be highly appreciated if you have anything to say here.

@Daimona Please correct me if it's possible to add a variable that doesn't show in the examine outputs.

No. Not in a stable/guaranteed way, at least (related: T234155). Since everything is logged for transparency, AF is a no-go if you want to keep connections secret (because by looking at the logs, it would be easy to figure them out). I don't really have any technical alternative to propose. Perhaps have a dedicated page on another namespace where mentees can ping people, or a filter to selectively block vandalisms on talk pages. BTW, "protected talk pages" is quite scary IMHO.

In general AbuseFilter seems like a bad approach - the user experience of being blocked by an abuse filter is poor as they only run on save. The least awkward approach is probably a custom protection level (so there is a convenient UI for managing it) and a userCan hook.

On T265214#6588131, a user from pt.wp indicated that this new protection system would help them.

In general AbuseFilter seems like a bad approach - the user experience of being blocked by an abuse filter is poor as they only run on save. The least awkward approach is probably a custom protection level (so there is a convenient UI for managing it) and a userCan hook.

Might be, through this is the easiest solution I was able to figure out. As the usage spreads, a custom protection level sounds like a better solution indeed.

ukwiki is currently under attack of rather persistent vandal(s) who write obscenities on the talk pages of experienced users, including mentors. So we would be very glad to have a way to allow mentees write while block others from writing.

Is it possible to temporarily not assign new mentees to the mentors with protected talk page? (Is this what T244258 is about?)

ukwiki is currently under attack of rather persistent vandal(s) who write obscenities on the talk pages of experienced users, including mentors. So we would be very glad to have a way to allow mentees write while block others from writing.

Would that help? The vandal could still create new accounts and vandalize the talk pages of the mentors of those accounts.
Some custom defense based on IPs or other characteristics might have more chance of succeeding, IMO.

Is it possible to temporarily not assign new mentees to the mentors with protected talk page? (Is this what T244258 is about?)

Not at the moment (and yes).

Would that help? The vandal could still create new accounts and vandalize the talk pages of the mentors of those accounts.
Some custom defense based on IPs or other characteristics might have more chance of succeeding, IMO.

Yes, that would help. The vandal would be blocked anyway (and the same vandal wouldn't be able to purposefully target one and the same mentor's talk page), but at least we wouldn't have to protect the mentor's talk page from all the mentees.
Custom defense doesn't work.

If we work with more communities in the future, we need to offer good tools to mentors so that they can help newcomers without side effects. I think this task should be in our Scaling plans.

Pppery renamed this task from Allow mentors to protect their talk page from non-mentees to Allow mentor talk pages to be protected from non-mentees.Oct 29 2023, 6:18 PM