Hello folks. The SDC team needs test-commons up longer because Beta Commons can only point to Beta Wikidata, which is full of dummy entities that don't at all represent what's actually on Wikidata.

@greg heads up, sir, we're planning on using test Commons through September, per our chat.

Another extension to Dec 2019, per another conversation with Greg G.

In T213295#5463390, @Abit wrote:

Another extension to Dec 2019, per another conversation with Greg G.

(just publicly ack'ing)

When is it going now? ;)

In T213295#6067354, @Reedy wrote:

When is it going now? ;)

We don't know.

The wiki is scheduled to be closed and deleted in December 2019, so don't get too attached to it!

It's over a year past that date now...

@Jdforrester-WMF Is this wiki still needed?

In T213295#7860977, @Ameisenigel wrote:

@Jdforrester-WMF Is this wiki still needed?

Probably. You should ask the Structured Data team, on whose behalf I requested its creation and removal.

@CBogen Could you answer this question?

added @CBogen to https://phabricator.wikimedia.org/project/profile/3633/ for visbility

In T213295#7860991, @Jdforrester-WMF wrote:

In T213295#7860977, @Ameisenigel wrote:

@Jdforrester-WMF Is this wiki still needed?

Probably. You should ask the Structured Data team, on whose behalf I requested its creation and removal.

This wiki is no longer needed. Thanks for checking in with us.

Change 893058 had a related patch set uploaded (by Zabe; author: Zabe):

[operations/mediawiki-config@master] close testcommonswiki

https://gerrit.wikimedia.org/r/893058

Change 893058 merged by jenkins-bot:

[operations/mediawiki-config@master] close testcommonswiki

https://gerrit.wikimedia.org/r/893058

Mentioned in SAL (#wikimedia-operations) [2023-02-28T22:31:01Z] <zabe@deploy2002> Synchronized dblists/: close testcommonswiki T213295 (duration: 06m 40s)

Change 893066 had a related patch set uploaded (by Zabe; author: Zabe):

[operations/mediawiki-config@master] Drop custom testcommonswiki groups

https://gerrit.wikimedia.org/r/893066

Mentioned in SAL (#wikimedia-operations) [2023-02-28T22:46:43Z] <zabe@deploy2002> Synchronized dblists/: close testcommonswiki T213295 (duration: 07m 11s)

Change 893066 merged by jenkins-bot:

[operations/mediawiki-config@master] Drop custom testcommonswiki groups

https://gerrit.wikimedia.org/r/893066

Mentioned in SAL (#wikimedia-operations) [2023-02-28T23:12:33Z] <zabe@deploy2002> Started scap: Backport for [[gerrit:893066|Drop custom testcommonswiki groups (T213295)]]

Mentioned in SAL (#wikimedia-operations) [2023-02-28T23:14:17Z] <zabe@deploy2002> zabe: Backport for [[gerrit:893066|Drop custom testcommonswiki groups (T213295)]] synced to the testservers: mwdebug1001.eqiad.wmnet, mwdebug2002.codfw.wmnet, mwdebug1002.eqiad.wmnet, mwdebug2001.codfw.wmnet

Mentioned in SAL (#wikimedia-operations) [2023-02-28T23:20:30Z] <zabe@deploy2002> Finished scap: Backport for [[gerrit:893066|Drop custom testcommonswiki groups (T213295)]] (duration: 07m 57s)

Change 893080 had a related patch set uploaded (by Zabe; author: Zabe):

[operations/mediawiki-config@master] testcommonswiki: Remove some settings which are no longer needed

https://gerrit.wikimedia.org/r/893080

Change 893080 merged by jenkins-bot:

[operations/mediawiki-config@master] testcommonswiki: Remove some settings which are no longer needed

https://gerrit.wikimedia.org/r/893080

Mentioned in SAL (#wikimedia-operations) [2023-02-28T23:43:54Z] <zabe@deploy2002> Synchronized wmf-config/InitialiseSettings.php: T213295 (duration: 06m 56s)

I closed the wiki now since by now basically all of it's traffic were spambots.

@Zabe is there any more work to be done, or can this task be closed?

That depends on whether the intention is still to delete the wiki completely or if closing it is sufficient.

Okay, thanks. IMO deletion should happen as there's no use for the contents of the test wiki.

In T213295#8666790, @EpicPupper wrote:

Okay, thanks. IMO deletion should happen as there's no use for the contents of the test wiki.

I agree with that.

Have we ever deleted a wiki (from a database point of view). I remember years ago we tried, but I don't remember if we actually did it, I think we simply left it as "delete" but never actually went ahead and deleted the database (which I am fine with as testcommons is only 137M on disk - so probably not worth the risk of trying to delete it for the first time.)
Maybe @Jdforrester-WMF remembers that discussion we had years ago? :)

We even have a guide for doing this: https://wikitech.wikimedia.org/wiki/Delete_a_wiki

We have deleted some wikis in the past. The Klingon Wikipedia (tlhwiki) would be an example.

In T213295#8667968, @Ameisenigel wrote:

We even have a guide for doing this: https://wikitech.wikimedia.org/wiki/Delete_a_wiki

We have deleted some wikis in the past. The Klingon Wikipedia (tlhwiki) would be an example.

I was referring to the actual database deletion, which is also mentioned in the second line of that wiki page as something usually not worth doing:

When we delete a wiki, the steps outlined below need to be performed, which makes MediaWiki claim that the wiki does not exist. Actually deleting the data from all of the database servers would be quite a bit more complicated, and is usually not worth doing.

In T213295#8667137, @Marostegui wrote:

Have we ever deleted a wiki (from a database point of view). I remember years ago we tried, but I don't remember if we actually did it, I think we simply left it as "delete" but never actually went ahead and deleted the database (which I am fine with as testcommons is only 137M on disk - so probably not worth the risk of trying to delete it for the first time.)
Maybe @Jdforrester-WMF remembers that discussion we had years ago? :)

Yeah, this was "delete from MariaDB", not "delete from ExternalStore".

In T213295#10156934, @Zabe wrote:

Partialy resolved by closing the wiki.
It was decided anyway that wikis wont be deleted anymore.

Was it actually closed? I still see it on s4.dblist

In T213295#10299168, @Marostegui wrote:

In T213295#10156934, @Zabe wrote:

Partialy resolved by closing the wiki.
It was decided anyway that wikis wont be deleted anymore.

Was it actually closed? I still see it on s4.dblist

Yes. Closing a wiki basically just means locking a wiki from edits or any other write operations for anyone besides stewards, sysadmins, global interface editors and staff. It does not delete anything from the db.

Closing a wiki has no real advantage from a technical perspective, we are mostly doing it when wikis have no longer anything happening on them besides vandalism in order to reduce the workload of fighting that vandalism.

In T213295#10299543, @Zabe wrote:

In T213295#10299168, @Marostegui wrote:

In T213295#10156934, @Zabe wrote:

Partialy resolved by closing the wiki.
It was decided anyway that wikis wont be deleted anymore.

Was it actually closed? I still see it on s4.dblist

Yes. Closing a wiki basically just means locking a wiki from edits or any other write operations for anyone besides stewards, sysadmins, global interface editors and staff. It does not delete anything from the db.

I am aware of those implications

Closing a wiki has no real advantage from a technical perspective, we are mostly doing it when wikis have no longer anything happening on them besides vandalism in order to reduce the workload of fighting that vandalism.

I don't know what is the exact procedure but I would have expected it to go to closed.dblist. For us (DBAs) it does make a difference, because if it keeps showing in up s4.dblist it means we still have to do maintenance on it (mostly schema changes) whereas if it is on closed dblist we don't have to.

In T213295#10299616, @Marostegui wrote:

In T213295#10299543, @Zabe wrote:

In T213295#10299168, @Marostegui wrote:

In T213295#10156934, @Zabe wrote:

Partialy resolved by closing the wiki.
It was decided anyway that wikis wont be deleted anymore.

Was it actually closed? I still see it on s4.dblist

Yes. Closing a wiki basically just means locking a wiki from edits or any other write operations for anyone besides stewards, sysadmins, global interface editors and staff. It does not delete anything from the db.

I am aware of those implications

Closing a wiki has no real advantage from a technical perspective, we are mostly doing it when wikis have no longer anything happening on them besides vandalism in order to reduce the workload of fighting that vandalism.

I don't know what is the exact procedure but I would have expected it to go to closed.dblist. For us (DBAs) it does make a difference, because if it keeps showing in up s4.dblist it means we still have to do maintenance on it (mostly schema changes) whereas if it is on closed dblist we don't have to.

It ist part of closed.dblist. But since we do not want to break read's on closed wikis, we still keep them in their db section dblist and (at least in my understanding) they are also supposed to get schema changes (since not applying them to closed wikis would cause accessing them throwing exceptions within a few months).

Got it, thanks for the explanation @Zabe